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Forum » Alternative Fuel Car Forum » Alternative Fuels and their cars

Bioethanol

Author	Message
Written on: 06. 07. 08 [11:29]
ecoadmin Administrator Topic creator registered since: 20.07.2007 Posts: 387	I am member of myblueplanet, a local organsisation trying to raise awareness of environmental issues and to animate people to REDUCE, REUSE, REPAIR, RECYCLE. It was launched in 2007, is growing and is supported by a number of local businesses. I was asked to be part of the 'Knowledge Center' Road Transport and Mobility. Its a group of people where every member brings in his expertise and knowledge of a subject, forming a knowledge pool. When in negotiations with companies, authorities etc. those 'experts' can be called upon. This Monday, we will meet a head of a company who would like to convert 100 cars to be Bioethanol ready. In Switzerland most Bioethanol is coming at present from a cellulose plant and its waste material is used to produce bioethanol. The ethanol can be added to regular gas (max 5%) without the need to modify the car. If all gas in Switzerland would use 5% bioethanol, the cellulose plant could deliver 50% of all required ethanol. The rest of the ethanol would come from abroad (Europe, Brazil...) So the question is, is this business to be supported? Does it make sense to promote the use of Bioethanol to such an extent that eventually part of it has to be imported? Wouldn't the bioethanol not better be burned to generate electricity or to heat homes/water instead of burning it inefficiently on the road? Isn't the bioethanol-idea not just a try to continue as we do? Go anywhere at anytime without actually changing our lifestyle in overboost-mode? Or is it a step into the right direction, an intermediate step to a less polluted world and a lower dependance on foreign oil? I think its a bit a thightrope walk and depends on the way the use of Bioethanol is controlled and regulated (import). If locally produced it reduces the dependance on foreign oil. Good. But if widely accepted and promoted it could lead to questionable imports with all the problems associated with it. The percentage of biofuel used in road transport is expected to be at around 5% in the future (20 or so...?). Too small to worry about? I would love to hear from you on how we should approach this company and take the inputs to the meeting. I'll let you all know how it went... Best, Stephen ecocarforum.com - Green Car Network Community for sustainable transport
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Written on: 06. 07. 08 [23:25]
Lensman registered since: 31.05.2008 Posts: 81	I think anything which can turn waste into a useful product is a Good Thing. One of the problems highly industrialized society has is massive waste, and I think any move in the opposite direction is Good. Will biofuels turn out to be merely a stopgap measure in the transition towards pollution-free power generation? Or will it turn out to have a long-term use? I suspect the latter. There will continue to be places where fuel-powered engines will be necessary. Electric power can't power a jet aircraft, and I doubt we want our airlines to return to prop-driven planes. There will always be places in the world where it's not possible to plug a car in for overnight charging. There are countries and areas where 100% ethanol powered cars make sense. Brazil has managed to eliminate their dependence on foreign oil using ethanol. But ethanol is a low-energy fuel, and it doesn't have sufficient power to start an engine on cold winter nights. So a 100% ethanol-powered car doesn't appear to be practical here in the Midwest USA... nor in Switzerland. And ethanol isn't practical to run jet engines, either. What we really need is a way to turn biowaste directly into high-grade gasoline or aviation fuel. *That*, in my opinion, is the goal the biofuel industry should be working toward-- not producing more ethanol. Look at how the spiraling price of aviation fuel has affected the airlines. Ticket prices shooting up, airlines going out of business left and right. *This* is one area where biofuel could make a *real* difference. As far as the other issues involved, such as (1) The large percentage of energy lost in making, transporting, and converting biomass to fuel; and (2) The problem of food crops being diverted to biofuel and thus driving up food prices... I think you're much more informed on those issues than I am. I will merely repeat the advice I've heard about how to make a difficult decision: Write down on paper in one column all the reasons for the idea, and in a column next to it all the reasons against it. Then decide whether you think the good outweighs the bad, or vice versa. [This article was edited 2 times, at last 06.07.2008 at 23:52.]
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Written on: 09. 07. 08 [19:28]
ecoadmin Administrator Topic creator registered since: 20.07.2007 Posts: 387	Hello Lensman and all, Thanks for your advice and tips, it was a long meeting and the organisation has just decided to drop the project. Its a rather complex issue: The CEO of the company we have met is president of a community of interests promoting the use of Bioethanol. His company is also selling Eco-Tuning (Chip Tuning). His intention was to use us mainly as 'communication channel'. That of course is nothing else than 'advertisement'. To join the project we would have also had to invest a rather big amount of time with no benefits on our side. We dropped the project, because -we don't want to be used as advertising platform -CO2 savings have to be proven (not the case with eco-tuning) -risks associated with mass production of bioethanol and possible imports are not resolved It also seemed to me that we were talking to someone from the car industry having mainly financial interests. It just didn't convince us enough! ecocarforum.com - Green Car Network Community for sustainable transport
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Written on: 10. 07. 08 [09:57]
childress registered since: 14.08.2007 Posts: 81	We have a term for that in the states -- it's called greenwashing. It's a throwback to whitewashing, which is what in the olden days you used to do to walls (and fences) in your home to cover up the dirt. Greenwashing therefore is a thin coating of green (heavily advertised) in an attempt to cover up a whole lotta of ungreen practices. Commute suck? Twike it; You'll like it! http://www.uiuc.edu/goto/twike
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